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Which means "Evil Twin". Lets see your projects where you change boring into fun or create the fun from scratch.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:38 am 
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mk e wrote:
Now that the engine has been in and test run and everything seems to fit and work there is finishing up stuff to get on with. This is way I started the part4 threat....this is very different work.

The big one is heat management. The factory V8 headers and pipes were insulated. That was all beat up when I got the car so I replaced it with 2 layers of header wrap then painted with high temp silver to make it look at least decent and you could touch the pipes after a drive! That stuff works good so I'm kind of leaning toward doing that to the new V12 exhaust. I really REALLY want to believe that having everything ceramic coated would be just as good since it looks so much nicer....maybe do the coating and see???....but I know the wrap works and since everything is 304SS it really can't cause corrosion like it does on mild steel headers. I'll need to thing about that while I have everything apart....but the ceramic coating looks a lot better......



The other thing I go round and round on is an oil cooler. The V8 had one and needed it....needed it at least until I upgraded the radiator then I'm not so sure since oil temps were way lower after that....but I still had it so I don't know....in fact I more than don't kow because the oil cooler was in the way doing the supercharger add so I switched to a water/oil type that I ran the engine coolant though so its a complete apples to oranges thing I guess. The one I used last time was like the pic below...I just put it in the hot water to the radiator aluminum tube thinking the oil wants to be warmer than the engine temp and the hot line means no need to add an oil thermostat, not sure that was a great idea but it seemed to work out ...but I could probably make something WAY cheaper. I need to think about that.
I've always been unclear about the purpose of an oil cooler. Is it to aid in engine cooling? Or is it to just to keep the oil below its maximum operating temperature?


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:30 am 
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Brian A wrote:
I've always been unclear about the purpose of an oil cooler. Is it to aid in engine cooling? Or is it to just to keep the oil below its maximum operating temperature?


I think the answer is yes ;)

Stuff like the cam, crank and pistons are oil cooled. so oil certainly places a role in cooling the engine.

...but then oil flows though passages in the block so the hot oil will pass some heat to the block which in turn passes it to the radiator. The temp of the oil will increase until the transfer of heat to the block equals the transfer of heat into the oil from the crank mostly but all the stuff the oil feeds.

This is kind of uncontrolled so oil temp will vary quite a bit depending on engine load/rpm/etc. oil viscosity changes with temp so the ooil's abilty to protect the bearings is also uncontrolled. The basic answer is pick an oil thick enough to work at worst case use and live with the fact that its costing extra hp to pump and doesn't lube as well most of the time.

A dedicated oil cooler with a thermostat controls the oil temp so you can use a thinner oil that is better under normal conditions and know it will survive at worst case conditions...because you're actually controlling the oils temp so its at optimal temp once the engine is up to temp.

Just adding an oil cooler in the air (or water) stream lowers the oil temp. Still uncontrolled but lower than it would otherwise be so you can get away with thinner oil. Car companies that want like a 0w20 for cold startup protection might opt to throw on a cooler or if you're already running 20w50 and seeing temps it's probably not happy at a cooler is needed.

The setup I used to have with the oil cooler on the hot water side is also an oil heater to help get the oil up to temp sooner. The "cooler" will be at at least 170C and become a heater during warmup, then become a cooler. It needs to be larger setup this way I think since the sink temp is 170-190C not 20-30C air temp when cooling is needed but it can provided really stable oil temps which translate to stable bearing protection.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:56 pm 
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mk e wrote:
... The basic answer is pick an oil thick enough to work at worst case use and live with the fact that its costing extra hp to pump and doesn't lube as well most of the time...
Interesting.

Presumably modern synthetics moot the issue to some degree since they tolerate much higher temperatures than the oils of the 1980s and now have such wide multigrade ranges (e.g. 0W40).


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:42 pm 
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For some reason baby wanted a bath and her picture taken tonight.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:16 am 
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Brian A wrote:
mk e wrote:
... The basic answer is pick an oil thick enough to work at worst case use and live with the fact that its costing extra hp to pump and doesn't lube as well most of the time...
Interesting.

Presumably modern synthetics moot the issue to some degree since they tolerate much higher temperatures than the oils of the 1980s and now have such wide multigrade ranges (e.g. 0W40).


Yeah...the Enzo uses what was $60/qt 0w60 iirc....and also has an oil cooler. Engineers love to control things :)


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 8:19 am 
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Brian A wrote:

Presumably modern synthetics moot the issue to some degree since they tolerate much higher temperatures than the oils of the 1980s and now have such wide multigrade ranges (e.g. 0W40).



Yeah...the Enzo uses what was $60/qt 0w60 iirc....and also has an oil cooler. Engineers love to control things :)

I really think I'll have heat problems if I don't take action on at least the exhaust....in theory at full song this engine can drain the 18 gal fuel tanks in about 15 minutes.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:24 pm 
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Great news Mark , shop looks good . Looking forward to the next installment .


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:26 pm 
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mk e wrote:
For some reason baby wanted a bath and her picture taken tonight.


So the reason is the pics are for grassroots motorsports magazine....there should be a little blurb in the next edition so keep your eyes opened. Kind of cool.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:27 pm 
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duck.co.za wrote:
Great news Mark , shop looks good . Looking forward to the next installment .


Thanks.....now goes your project? TBs? Engine?


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:24 pm 
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mk e wrote:
mk e wrote:
For some reason baby wanted a bath and her picture taken tonight.


So the reason is the pics are for grassroots motorsports magazine....there should be a little blurb in the next edition so keep your eyes opened. Kind of cool.


Road and Track too it seems

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cultur ... -v12-swap/


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